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11.20 reaction 
5th-May-2016 11:07 pm
That's Just not right
A very short, very negative reaction. Please be warned (I mean it. Not a happy camper - so, you know, don't click).

(*meep* and my comments are full of unmitigated bitterness too. So yeah. Don't read! You know the drill!)

at least there was ironingCollapse )
Comments 
6th-May-2016 06:39 am (UTC)
I enjoyed it a lot. I thought it treated the concept of "God" with all the respect it deserves, which is to say none at all, and I admired them for putting a face and some definite statements to such a big idea. I was completely engaged during the Chuck and Metratron scenes, wondering what else they were going to reveal about "God"! I've never thought a god (if there was any such thing) would be on the side of good, so it didn't concern me that he has allowed Sam and Dean to suffer – I wouldn't expect him to care.

What will upset me is if they back away from this irreverent treatment and have Chuck save the day and everyone worship him!

They even made me like Metratron a bit, having him give his pastrami to the dog!

Edit: I did however think the amulet resurrection was sloppy in the extreme. Even if you're God, you can't just produce it out of thin air and say, I made it not work before.

Edited at 2016-05-06 06:41 am (UTC)
6th-May-2016 07:19 am (UTC)
I'm thinking this might have been an episode I would have enjoyed more if I had watched it with people! :)

I think the fact that I was bored during the Metatron and God scenes went someway to making me so angry by the end. I'm not sure why I was so un-engaged. The acting was good and the writing was ok. I suppose, I just didn't care enough. And I honestly didn't think they'd reveal Chuck as God. Now whenever I watch any episode with Chuck in it all I will think of is "you knew Sam was going to hell and you did nothing about it". He's now become my least fave character. Now that Metatron has become "nice", they've made room for another all powerful dick (which I think is fine actually. Someone with almighty power would be a dick).

What will upset me is if they back away from this irreverent treatment and have Chuck save the day and everyone worship him!

I was already getting that vibe. By the end it was just that. I've come to save the day! look I've returned the amulet! I am wonderful! Meanwhile I was eye rolling and just saying noooooooooooo.

The resurrection was unnecessary at that point in the episode I felt. Pure and utter fan service. Why on earth it was put in Sam's pocket (other than to have fans argue over whether Sam has had it all this time) is beyond me. I would much rather he'd have fixed everyone and then calmly walked up to Dean with the amulet and say "you're going to need this". Dean walking around with it glowing in his hand...I just. Argh.

Dammit Sorry. I've been so ranty pants about this episode. Unjustly so I think, but I'm just do annoyed. At least Sam and Dean weren't at odds. I've enjoyed that most about this season. :)
8th-May-2016 07:22 am (UTC)
Why on earth it was put in Sam's pocket (other than to have fans argue over whether Sam has had it all this time) is beyond me. I would much rather he'd have fixed everyone and then calmly walked up to Dean with the amulet and say "you're going to need this".

If is was originally in Sam's pocket (and not hidden by Sam elsewhere), then right after Chuck activated it in the bar, he simply put it back where he found it. If Chuck had handed it to Dean later, then it wouldn't have been a brother moment... Dean wouldn't have seen, first hand, that Sam had kept the amulet all those years. The amulet was designed to lead a person to God, and it made sense to me that the boys would use it to guide them, rather than have God hand it to them.
7th-May-2016 01:23 am (UTC)
I'm sorry that you're so upset about the ep, hon. I thought you'd love this one... I'm really surprised to see your reaction. I loved it so much!

About Chuck being "real" and allowing Sam and Dean to suffer... They pretty much gave away that Chuck was God in Swan Song, so the reveal didn't surprise me. With Amara being the core of the mytharc, it fits for God to make an appearance this season. Like you say, he could've snapped his fingers and changed everything. He could've saved Sam and Dean from all the terrible things that have happened to them. He was right there with them in season 5 (and as someone who sees all and knows all, he's always been aware of what's happening to them). I see him as having made his creation, given them free will, taken off the training wheels, and stepped back. There's a few times when he helped Sam and Dean, but most of the time he hasn't. If Chuck fixed everything all the time, we wouldn't have a show, so it makes sense to me that he's a character with issues about the role he plays in his universe. It sucks that Chuck was around and didn't save Sam from going to hell and suffering, but if Chuck fixed everything, then Sam doesn't save the world, and Sam's purpose and role in the mytharc is changed. I was ok with Chuck intervening at the end of the ep, because Metatron had gotten through to him, and I see it as a gesture of someone who's ready to say goodbye to his world, his creation... doing one good deed before it's over. Chuck has flaws, and issues, and that makes him more "real" to me, then if he was off in the corner of the universe somewhere.

About the amulet..

Their brotherhood had nothing to do with it's return. :(

But I think it did! They were in a moment of crisis, with Sam dying, and Dean wanting to die with him... and in his anguish, Dean cried out for all this to "stop"... and that's when the amulet glowed, eventually leading them to Chuck. It happened at a moment when the boys were at their closest. It represents their love, and their bond, and it came through for them in one of their greatest moments of need. Anyway, I'm thrilled that the Samulet has returned! I'm sad to hear that you're not happy about it.
7th-May-2016 03:10 am (UTC)
Hey! I'm really happy you enjoyed it. :)

As I've said to those above who had a positive reaction - it's not fair that I respond to your comments with my PoV because, well, it would be rude of me. I just didn't see the episode in the way those who loved it did

However, I will say. Finding out the Robbie is leaving the show makes it absolutely clear what he was doing here. I could see it in the ep (which is what annoyed me), but know I know it was his Swan Song - and returning the amulet (and possibly God) was his gift to fandom it makes more sense.

And also - I do like your interpretation of the amulet. I think anything is open in this one and I think I'll adopt yours (now that the rage is easing..;D)
7th-May-2016 01:12 pm (UTC)
:)

I'm glad that it makes more sense to you, now that you know that Robbie is leaving. And yay that you like my interpretation of the amulet, and that you'll "adopt" it. But in your next post, you say this....

I also think the way it was returned (via God) removes the initial connection the brothers had to it - as a gift of brotherhood from Sam to Dean.

I thought you were saying that my interpretation made sense to you, and that you adopted it, but now you're saying you still feel the same way that you originally did?
8th-May-2016 12:57 am (UTC)
haha. ah yes. That does sound contradictory. Saying I'll adopt it meant I really liked it - it doesn'tt take away what I actually believe it about- or that it takes away my problem with it.

What I mean is I really like it an an idea and makes sense to me. When I was writing up the next post my original idea was still there - even though I liked your idea very much.

And now both Jared and Jensen have come out to say that they believe Sam had it all the time. Which I know they've also made up an interpretation which works for their characters (and I'd say the history of the amulet).

And honestly now? I'm not sure. I find it difficult to believe that Sam carried it around all this time and just happened to have it in his pocket. If anything I am going with Sam had it hidden, God took it to show Metatron and when Dean called out God heard it and put it back. That's probably my fanon - to help make sense of it. But I still hold my original issue with itj.

Ack. Sorry, hope that makes some sense.

8th-May-2016 04:46 am (UTC)
Saying I'll adopt it meant I really liked it - it doesn'tt take away what I actually believe it about- or that it takes away my problem with it.

Sorry hon... I'm not sure I understand, because you like it and it makes sense to you, but it hasn't made any difference in how you view the issue.

And now both Jared and Jensen have come out to say that they believe Sam had it all the time. Which I know they've also made up an interpretation which works for their characters

I don't think they'd make up something like that. They've clarified before if they say something and it's headcanon , so for them to acknowledge that Sam had the samulet all along... I believe them.

Yes, it could've been hidden by Sam... what you say about it makes sense. Also, it could've been in his pocket. That's another good question to ask at a Con!
8th-May-2016 12:46 pm (UTC)
I don't think they'd make up something like that.

The only reason I said that is because previously Jim Michaels confirmed via a tweet that God put the amulet in Sam's pocket. That doesn't mean that Sam didn't have it all the time of course, but when asked how the amulet got there Jim said God out it there. So yeah, I don't know. My cynical brain says it wasn't discussed, but fandom brain says God took it from Sam's hiding place and put it in his pocket. But I think it's open to interpretation.

I'm not sure I understand, because you like it and it makes sense to you, but it hasn't made any difference in how you view the issue.

um yes? Bit like above. My cynical brain wrestles with my fandom brain. ;)


7th-May-2016 07:18 am (UTC)
Oh, wow. Oof.

It reminds me of how at the end of S5, my bestie brosedshield and I were displeased with some things they were doing (WE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT WAS COMING), and especially with the implications of Kripke = Chuck = God. We came up with a petty but amusing acronym that summed up our feelings: DWKG, for Dickface Wordsworth Kripke God. (The Wordsworth reference stemmed from a literature class we shared, in which we learned that Wordsworth heavily implied in his poetry that he was basically god as well.) And that's how we referred to the power inside and outside Show, manipulating all these events, from then on.

Anyway, I thought you might appreciate that acronym now.

I hope I see a gif of the hair-petting, at any rate.
7th-May-2016 11:27 am (UTC)
Haha! Oh that's hilarious!

And I'm thinking that Robbie inserted himself in the script also, so now he's God too!

There were some nice broments in the episode - which I haven't mentioned much. But Dean's panic over Sam being hurt was, as always, lovely. And Dean once again tried to kill himself to stay with Sam (he tried to infect himself with the Sam stuff Sam was dying from). Those two! It's nice to remember those little moments.:)
7th-May-2016 08:46 am (UTC)
I think what bothered me most - and yeah, there was a list, but right now I'll concentrate on just this one - by making SPN god in the form of Chuck they missed the whole point of how I'd imagined SPN god to be. I don't think I'm making sense here - what I'm trying to say is it was obvious that both Chuck as a character and the actor are some fan favourites and the writing reflected that.

The big problem with this show is that none of the characters - or I'll go further and say none of the actors want to really be an utter total tool of a bastard.

And I think that's what I needed to sell this. I needed god to be the ultimate, arrogant dick. As the creator of heaven I wanted - needed him to out dick Uriel and Zac. To make it work for me their god had to know what was going on and either find it amusing, his angels manipulating humanity to bring on the apocalypse and to mock their efforts, or to not care less. But sadly they sat Metatron and Chuck down and kept telling me what nice guys they are and they're not - neither of them. Let's just ignore the whole angels needing human souls for power thing - if god created souls, then he created humans as mere angel fodder - and that would be good - go for it, god's a huge dick not a nice misunderstood troubadour.

*sigh* I'm not interested in the bland and, as sure as I am that many love Rob's singing, I didn't - corny and bland - a double whammy.

The resurrection of the chosen few pissed me off.
7th-May-2016 11:36 am (UTC)
what I'm trying to say is it was obvious that both Chuck as a character and the actor are some fan favourites and the writing reflected that.

I've just written another entry (mostly because I needed to get it out of my system) but using Rob's con persona was very problematic. This isn't at all how I thought God would be. Even though everyone said it was Chuck it never felt right to me. It also makes little sense. Why would be stand by and let Sam suffer hell for 100 years? I just can't buy it.

god's a huge dick not a nice misunderstood troubadour.

Make it obvious what a huge dick he is! They toyed with it, but instead they redeemed Metatron and God "saw the light" and decided to save Sam and Dean. God came across as a spoil brat (much like Amara) but it just didn't feel enough. I dunno. Maybe it will come out more in future episodes. It will be such a hard sell with Rob playing the role. He's just too nice.

The resurrection of the chosen few pissed me off.

Just far too many questions. And where did that woman's husband suddenly appear from? God transported him from their house where she shot him?

As I say in the next post - if they don't come up with a solid reason why God doesn't heal people's suffering I will be simmering with anger. I suppose he could say "I just don't feel like it" and that might be enough to seal him being an utter dick. But will they go that route? Hard to say. And, as usual, I am just not that invested in this story line. I want them to be done with it. The MoTW eps have been so solid this season. Why can't they just stick with those?!
7th-May-2016 11:49 pm (UTC)
Late to the party, but I'm not surprised at all that they made God real (I think he's been real since Swan Song actually. That was pretty definitive to me.) especially after they killed Death. I mean that pretty much should have changed the entire natural world, but nope, it's business as usual.

And as for God saving the world... well, that's a Christian view of God, no? I mean there's all kinds of gods in the world, so who's to say that the Christians have the right one? I'd rather the Christian god not be the omnipotent ONE singular god who saves the world. It's too US/Christian centric and excludes too much of the rest of the world for my tastes. I'd rather see all the other pantheon of gods come together to send both Amara and Chuck into the void. That would be truly satisfying to me. (And whatever happened to all the monsters banding together to defeat the darkness. Did that ever go anywhere after that one episode? Urg, so many dropped plotlines with these crappy writers.)
8th-May-2016 01:06 am (UTC)
Ok. So this is really interesting to me. And wow, I would love for this to be the direction they take with it. I mean, they did do Hammer of the Gods so they have acknowledged other Gods in the show, so it wouldn't be completely off story to do that.

But then...he just saved those selected few - which suggests he could save anyone one else he wanted to. And he talked about creation which suggests (maybe) that they show is going for the US/Christian God. Agh. I don't know. And it would still mean he let Sam suffer terribly (which, unless something is said about that next week, I will never forgive them for). But I do really love the idea that he's not the only God and how AWESOME it would be if the other Gods got together and said ENOUGH of this world destroy bickering. You are in time out! Forever! (and take all the dick angels and demons with you - they keep causing misery too!) Ha.Oh happy days. :)

Dammit, now you've given me hope.

(And I just can't get my head around dropped plot lines. That episode, once again, just clarified that they pretty much make it up as they go and I really need to not get so caught up with it. I'm trying!)

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