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curled around these images
just enough to make us dangerous
12.13 reaction 
2nd-Mar-2017 07:45 pm
Sam & Dean
It took me a while to catch this episode (due to being away for a family gathering), but I've finally seen it and...surprise surprise...I actually liked it! :)

(it's mostly a surprise to me be because a) it was a Duo ep and b) it had Crowley and Rowena in it and I'm generally not that interested in their dramas)

I was ready to dismiss this episode as one that just wasn't going to be for me. I didn't make an effort to watch it while I was away because I just didn't think would be one that I'd like.

Turns out I did like it and, actually, it helped make more sense of what they're doing this season.

Sure, it had some MAJOR *head scratching* moments (which I'll touch on later) but because it had a couple of really good pay-offs (I'm all about the pay-offs!) it ended up being quite satisfying.

The main reason it worked for me is because Mary made more sense (compared to last week's episode where she seemed prepared to let her sons die) and Sam's torture was (finally!) mentioned. It also highlighted the theme that is running through this season - motherhood and parenting.

Sam and Dean were solid and I loved that when Sam was recalling his torture they cut to Dean's worried face. There was a lovely solidarity between them - especially when having to listen to what Mary has been up to.

I was relieved that Mary actually voiced her reasons for siding with the BMoL - they may be naive and short-sighted reasons, but at least she was able to let us know what's going on with her. I was also thankful she confessed to the boys - anytime a secret is out in the open is satisfying. I also really loved that we didn't get to hear what she said - just that she was giving them her reasons. I feel like I'm back on track with her characterisation after this episode.

I really liked the ghosty moments - they were pretty creepy and that's always a win. :)

I liked Gavin - his comment about not fitting mirrored Mary's and Cas's previous statements about not fitting in. He was also a good son (like Sam and Dean) to parents who aren't exactly paternal (maybe mirroring Mary and John?).

And I absolutely loved Mark's Lucifer. He is captivating to watch - his performance was devious, with an delicious edge of danger.

The music montage at the end was excellent.

All that said I think this episode works best without thinking too hard about it. Some of my *head scratches* were:

* I found it a tough sell that Crowley cared for Gavin at all. We've seen nothing of him since his last appearance and we've not seen Crowley develop a relationship with him. His death would have been much more powerful if that had been established before this episode. It did mirror the lack of connection we saw between Rowena and Oskar - the child she was supposed to have loved. I LIKED the revenge element from Rowena (very within her character), but it made little sense without us feeling anything for either of their losses.

* Cas seems to be having a very hard time locating Kelly, whereas others seemed to locate her easily (not surprising if she decides to walk backstreets by herself!)

* Time travel is always difficult to pull off and sending Gavin back would have changed so many timelines it's just not worth thinking about (not least that the teachers wouldn't have died so Sam and Dean wouldn't have investigated their deaths...etc. etc). Having Fiona appear during the spell also made no sense - he was being sent back so she wasn't bitter so that needed to happen before she/he died. Anyway *handwave*

* Crowley kept a rotting meat suit? Really? Why?! And how is it able to contain Lucifer now? (maybe I missed that piece of exposition).

After this episode I can see the potential for some interesting developments. I'd liked to be able to trust them with the exploration of parenting - if they can make it multi-faceted it could be really good. Even though I'm getting a sense that the show is getting kinda tired (or maybe that's just me?) it seems to be still managing to pull out some entertaining episodes.
2nd-Mar-2017 01:17 pm (UTC)
Sam and Dean's faces as Mary was explaining she was working with the BMoL just killed me (I had to write a fic about it)--Sam's tiny stutter when he brought up the torture--and the fact that Mary was paying attention to Dean's face, not Sam--all subtle character reinforcement for all of them that made her reveal so devastating.

And Rowena's scene at the end really elevated her character for me. Like most of the bad guys who end up working with the Winchesters (I'm looking at you, Crowley) she'd been seeming to turn weak. But not only did we see that she is still capable of some deep nastiness, it gave her depth that she hadn't had before.

Though you're right, the Crowley/Gavin attachment came out of nowhere pretty much...

My fic if you want to see it: http://borgmama1of5.livejournal.com/96522.html
3rd-Mar-2017 11:14 am (UTC)
Firstly, thanks for the link. I'll read it as soon as I have an opportunity. :)

And yes to your comments. I agree that Rowena has been elevated since this episodes and, in fact, I think they've been doing some interesting things with her characterisation. I think she can remain nasty but still develop within that.
2nd-Mar-2017 01:26 pm (UTC)
Yes, I'm with you all the way! I felt like we got a lot out of this episode, and despite some weaker moments, the payoff was wort it to me. I did think there was a lot of exposition (I'm sure they could have just said in a few words how Crowley brought Lucifer back - I don't know why we needed all of that information) and there were far too many flashbacks within the episode for me, but I did very much enjoy all the scenes with Rowena and Boys, Crowley and Rowena at the end, Lucifer montage (if Lucifer has to come back I'm thrilled to have Mark P! He gets that balance of humour and creepy so very well) and Mary and her boys.

Perhaps having a theme of family worked for the writers here, allowing them to focus down on what they needed to accomplish. And yes, there seems to be a lot different ways this family theme could go, and honestly, not knowing where this is heading is a huge accomplishment for a show that's been airing as long as this has.

Like you say there were head scratching moments (I'm not sure why they didn't burn the necklace to see if that worked? Surely sending an innocent back in time to die would be a last option, not the first?) but there was more good than bad for me.

I'm still watching and enjoying our show. Maybe I'm not as excited as I used to me, but after so many years being involved, I think that's OK. I still care about the characters, I still want to watch it and know what happens to them, and I still want to interact in fandom. I also think that's why episodes like 12.12 are so wonderful; trying new things and keep things interesting and fresh is always a positive.

Take care and thank you for sharing your reaction ♥
3rd-Mar-2017 11:18 am (UTC)
I'm not sure why they didn't burn the necklace to see if that worked? Surely sending an innocent back in time to die would be a last option, not the first?)

Yes! I thought that too. It shocked me that sending him back was done before other things were tried. Burning the necklace should have indeed been tried AND THEN think of other ideas when that didn't work.

I still care about the characters, I still want to watch it and know what happens to them,

Me too it seems. :) I always want to know what happens next - even when I'm not too thrilled about a particular direction.

2nd-Mar-2017 01:46 pm (UTC)
Is the show getting tired? I dunno - I think it might be more that WE are getting tired and the show is getting muddled. Reading fanfic shows there are a myriad of entertaining stories that could be told, but the show seems to be hopping about between telling some of those and rehashing stuff (not very well). However, it's still entertaining me enough, and I'm still invested enough to keep coming back!

I confess my general lack of interest in Castiel meant I hadn't really thought about his Kelly-incompetence but you're quite right! Re: Nick's meat suit, all that was said about that was a throw-away remark about Crowley having 'improved' it. My handwaving says demons have ways with dead meat suits that angels don't know about or don't sink so low as to try...
3rd-Mar-2017 11:24 am (UTC)
I think the tiredness (for me) is the sense of not having it do anything really daring lately. Perhaps it's best that they don't but I feel like I'm hanging out for them to do something unexpected (something with the bunker maybe? Perhaps we need another alternate universe episode (I do rather like those). I dunno - I suspect it's just me.

Cas just has to be off doing something (to explain why he isn't in the ep) and I don't think him not finding Kelly is a comment on his character. It must be quite challenging for the writers to constantly come up with reasons why Cas isn't there. Particularly now they've established he lives in the bunker - and he's family.
3rd-Mar-2017 11:56 am (UTC)
this week's felt finally challenging to me - I'm dying to know what you'll make of it!
3rd-Mar-2017 07:30 pm (UTC)
My head canon is that the angels stumbled on Kelly by chance rather than skill. It seems she is being tailed (or at least somehow monitored) by Dagon, and I think it would make sense a demon of her calibre could take her off the radar of angels and demons a like.

That's my head canon and I'm sticking to until show contradicts me haha
4th-Mar-2017 10:33 am (UTC)
Seems legit! :)
4th-Mar-2017 01:02 pm (UTC)
Have you seen this weeks episode yet? I'm halfway through my review so much to talk about.
4th-Mar-2017 01:17 pm (UTC)
yes! I absoultely loved it. :D I'm trying to write mine but I don't know where to start.
4th-Mar-2017 01:29 pm (UTC)
I'm hoping to get mine done in the next hour or two haha. Personally, I split it into the following sections: Winchester family drama (the longest section by far hehe), Sam, Mary and the BMoL, Dean and Ketch and then just random tidbits haha
4th-Mar-2017 11:08 pm (UTC)
I definitely agree it's best not to focus on the complete lack of logic in the episodes. I think the only reason I'm still able to watch is because I just assume they're going to be totally indifferent to it.

I did like the twist with Rowena, though as I missed two seasons I simply assumed more had gone on with Gavin (and I knew nothing about Oskar anyway).

The idea that Crowley kept a meat suit around is ludicrous given how long that would have been (back to S5, wasn't it?) Obviously hell is actually cold rather than hot because they clearly have top shelf deep freezes there...
5th-Mar-2017 12:00 pm (UTC)
though as I missed two seasons I simply assumed more had gone on with Gavin

Nope. There was a big set up that he'd be back, but it never happened. Until now.

(back to S5, wasn't it?)

We last saw Mark as Lucifer was in 7.17 (Born Again Idenity) - so that's 5 years he's been hanging on to that meat suit. So, nope. But I'm happy to see Mark back as Luci because he's good at it. :)

Obviously hell is actually cold rather than hot because they clearly have top shelf deep freezes there...

Haha! And there was an ep where it was stated that Hell was cold (but they forgot about that in later episodes...)
5th-Mar-2017 01:58 pm (UTC)
Hi sorry to butt in! And doubly sorry if I misunderstood you...

We last saw Mark as Lucifer was in 7.17 (Born Again Idenity) - so that's 5 years he's been hanging on to that meat suit.

The Mark as Lucifer we saw during the events of The Born Again Identity was actually a hallucination inside Sam (and later Castiel's head) as a result of the damage caused by the breaking of the wall. At best (if one chooses to believe it was actually Lucifer messing with him) it was a psychic image projected by Lucifer from the Cage.

The last time we saw Nick's physical body was when Lucifer abandoned Nick, in favour of Sam, during Swan Song, so it has been seven years. Technically it's been nine, but show seems to have forgotten about the year jumps between seasons 5 and 6 and 7 and 8, so let's say 7.

Edited at 2017-03-05 02:33 pm (UTC)
5th-Mar-2017 03:59 pm (UTC)
Hmm, S7 is pretty far back alright, but I thought the body that Mark Pellegrino represents got burned up back in S5 when Lucifer takes over Sam's body? I know that Sam later recalls Lucifer as having Pellegrino's face in flashbacks and such which I thought made sense given that it was the face that he always associated with Lucifer.

Then again, I've no idea how Castiel's form keeps getting re-used without Jimmy so it's another of those things that just makes no sense.
6th-Mar-2017 12:55 pm (UTC)
Oh yes! Of course. In S7 Lucifer is in his mind. So yeah - he's hung onto the body since S5.

And I think it was explained at some point that Cas chose the Jimmy form. Jimmy is dead and I believe Cas was able to take his form (or something!).
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